Nocturnal Lives

Musings from the mind of Amanda S. Green – Mother, Writer, Possessed by Cats

Consequences, Part Whatever

Yesterday, another soft target was attacked on American soil. This time, it was a group of Republican congressmen and their aides and family members who were out for an early morning baseball practice session. One man decided for whatever reason to stalk and then open fire on them. Fortunately, two members of the Capitol police were present and their heroic actions prevented the attack from being much worse than it was.

Those are the facts. There is a great deal of speculation about the gunman’s motivation and mental state at the time of the attack. I’ll hold off on passing judgment on him until we learn more. Yes, it does appear that his social media accounts were filled with anti-Trump rhetoric and more and we can probably draw some conclusions from that but I’ll wait. After all, look at how quickly things changed yesterday from what was being initially reported to what came out later in the day.

Besides, that’s not the purpose of today’s post. Today, I’m pointing the finger directly at those who have said that while they don’t agree with what the shooter did, those he targeted brought it on themselves. My only response to that is to say, “What the fuck?”

Many of those who I’ve seen saying Congressman Scalise deserved to be shot because of his support of the President are the same ones who decried the attack on Gabrielle Giffords at the top of their lungs. They claim the Republicans brought this on themselves because they are trying to dismantle the Affordable Care Act or because they are homophobic or any number of other accusations.

One person said they understood why the shooter acted as he did because they — the poster — lived in fear of what Trump would do to them because they’re gay. They are still waiting for the camps to be built and people to be rounded up.

Another said this is what happens when you don’t condemn a president who has so clearly committed treason. Now, when asked to provide evidence of said treason, none can be cited. Rumors and innuendo, all based in the fact that their preferred candidate didn’t win.

Others immediately turned what happened into another instance where they can flog their pet political agenda of taking guns away from the average citizen. At one point, the media characterized the handgun carried by the shooter as a semi-automatic that kept firing on its own. Anyone with even the slightest knowledge of weaponry would know that isn’t possible. But it sounded good in the media and the idiots ran with it.

What amazes me is that those who claim the shooter had reason to open fire on a soft target don’t see how their own rhetoric, and the rhetoric of so many others on their side of the political aisle, quite possibly helped the shooter form the mindset to do what he did. They don’t see anything wrong in saying that it’s all right to “hit a Nazi” or to spout the antiFA slogans. They don’t understand why they should be the ones standing up and condemning the property damage that has happened in the so-called protests or how they are the ones stifling free speech when they try to force universities and other organizations not to allow certain speakers to appear in public events.

When you are out there calling for the President to be killed, or for those who support him to face “the consequences”, you can’t then step back and accept no blame for what happened. It is time for each of us to look at how we “discuss” the issues and to realize discussion has been the last thing a number of us — on both sides — want.

Does this mean it is time to shut up? Hell no. But it is the time to listen and to note who is willing to discuss and who simply spouts rhetoric and calls for violence. It is time to hold those who do the latter responsible for their actions. It is against the law in many places to stand up in a crowded theater and shout “Fire!”, especially if people are injured as a result. There are certainly civil consequences for such action. Perhaps it is time that the same consequences be applied to hate speech, be it political hate speech or other.

For those of you who are saying Trump should be killed — or even that he should be tried for treason — ask yourselves this. How did you feel when people said that about Obama? Why did you feel that way? Now ask yourself this: what makes your objections to criticisms about Obama any more right than the objections to your criticisms about Trump?

Like the President or not, there is no justification for opening fire on a group of men and women out playing ball. There is no justification for opening fire on a group of people in the middle of an urban setting when those men and women are not combatants and you are not at war. There is absolutely no justification for opening fire on a group of people in a non-war situation when there are children present.

If you find yourself saying “but I understand why he did it,” then I suggest you need to re-examine your own values.

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25 Comments

  1. Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

    I’m getting more depressed when I hear the “excuses” from the Liberals.

    You’d think that they want a civil war. 🙁

    • I don’t get depressed. I get angry. They are like toddlers who don’t understand that the consequences apply to them just like they do to us. I’m about to the point of letting them burn their hands to learn the lesson.

    • Ivar Ivarson

      LibProgs have kicked at every prop and foundation of Western civilization for decades, even a century. They got their way, mostly, although not as fast as some of them wanted. They think we’ll cave once again. I’m not sure they’re wrong . . .

  2. Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

    Nod.

    My “depression” comes in part from “me not liking myself when I get angry”.

    I don’t like it and wonder how people can be so stupid.

  3. I had just seen the story when a friend dropped in, so naturally I mentioned it to her. She said, “Well, it was inevitable….”
    (Nods head)
    “…our leaders are so terrible there’s nothing to do but shoot them.”
    (Switches to banging head on wall)

    Didn’t really feel there was much room for discussion there.

    • First of all, welcome to the blog. Pardon me while I do a quick fan-girl squee!

      Now that I have that over with, I have seen all too many comments like yours today in various social media posts. It saddens and angers me. Saddens me because discussion is essential for us to understand what all sides of an issue feel and believe. It angers me because it is that sort of attitude that leads to the rhetoric and exploitation we’ve seen of late. (by exploitation, I’m talking things like Kathy Griffin’s beheaded Trump). The anger is there also for the double-standard. Those who didn’t agree with Obama could say nothing without being condemned for being racist and more and yet they see no issue with suggesting Trump and others in the Republican party should be killed.

  4. I find it incredible to the point of disbelief that progressives can be so tone deaf to what their arguments sound like to this 58 year old former east coast liberal. They are closer to fascists and nazis than to the happy warrior liberals like Hubert Humphrey and Tip O’Neil.

    • I know. I can only imagine what my father, a dyed-in-the-wool Democrat would say if he were still alive. He’d be appalled by the rhetoric coming out of those proclaiming to belong to “his” party.

  5. Lewin W. Wickes

    Talk about polarization! Although I am a Republican, I did not vote for Trump. I voted Libertarian. The only thing that could incline me to support the current president is the behavior of Democrats. They have done it. The torrent of vicious hatred from Democrats now resembles the anti-Semitic mindset. That’s far more dangerous to decent governance than anything the current administration might do.

    • I voted the same way and have watched more and more people who would never have voted Republican swaying in that direction because what is coming out of the mouths of the liberals. A lot of the reason for it is that they see too many similarities between what the Democrats are saying and the loss of freedoms. No matter what the Dems say, they are the ones who are trying to shut down free speech and freedom of association and so much more. It’s truly frightening to think where this might go before they realize they have gone too far.

    • Ivar Ivarson

      OMG, Mr. Wickes, you Libertarians are coming to leave me alone! Have you no community spirit?

  6. Richard Aubrey

    It is a waste of time and energy to discuss this with the left as if they have standards, or as if they have the standards they hold the rest of the nation to. There’s no leverage there. The rest of the country can discuss this amongst themselves for whatever reason. but presuming it has any meaning to the left is futile.

    • You’re right where the “true believers” are concerned. Still, we need to keep the conversation going for those who haven’t fallen into lock-step with the left and who are still willing to think about what’s happening and the implications on our future.

      • Richard Aubrey

        Never met any. Whether on line, in person, social media, watching other discussions, after two–no more–interactions involving facts, the dem/lib.progressive/lefty either drops the discussion or goes to ad hom. They lie. They know they lie. Once they find out you know too much to fall for it, they switch to shaming, insult, accusations of “hate” or whatever phobia occurs to them, or, from time to time, violence.
        Worked with the left–sort of an accident–on campus fifty years ago. Noted then that their recruiting didn’t attract many mesomorphs. I was an exception and curiosity. Seems the low proportion of mesomorphs in the left is still the case.
        Just sayin’.

        • Ha! You beat me to it. Where do we find these shy, elusive creatures, leftists who aren’t in lockstep and are still willing to think about what’s happening? Every leftist I know (and that’s most of my acquaintances, since I live in Austin) responds to any attempt at discussion with a quick dose of STFU. Keep the conversation going? It never even started.

          • That’s part of the problem. You live in the wrong part of Texas. 😉

            • I know, I know. If we got out of Austin maybe we could have some sane acquaintances. But you know, the Austin types would still be crazy even if I weren’t (reluctantly) observing them.

              Anyway, we can’t move. Too many books. I designed part of this house to accommodate more books (a wide hallway lined with bookshelves on each side). That, plus two rooms lined with shelves, plus overflow bookcases in the other rooms, almost contains the books. I’d never find another house like this.

  7. Chancellor

    I was with you until the hate speech paragraph. Legislating speech – even really bad speech – will end in even worse consequences. One needs to observe what is happening at universities today and realize that’s simply a microcosm of what would happen in society should speech codes be put in place that legislated “hate speech”. I’d venture to say your article would be considered “political hate speech” on many campuses today.

    • If you thought I was advocating legislating hate speech, that’s not what I meant. I hate such legislation because it is too open for interpretation long after the law is passed. And you’re right, it would be seen as hate speech in some places and I’m sure there would be some who would need their safe space and blankie after reading it. Perhaps I should have said hate-filled speech since “hate speech” has a very specific connotation these days.

      • Chancellor

        Appreciate the quick reply. This is the section that threw me – “It is against the law in many places to stand up in a crowded theater and shout “Fire!”, especially if people are injured as a result. There are certainly civil consequences for such action. Perhaps it is time that the same consequences be applied to hate speech, be it political hate speech or other.”

        That seemed to indicate you favor legal consequences for hate/hate-filled speech.

        Other than that, loved your post. I’ll be back often. 🙂

  8. R.C.

    I don’t think we should be playing to the narrative by allowing comparisons between Jared Laughner and this latest attacker.

    This latest attacker was a progressive/leftist, a Bernie supporter, who clearly and unambiguously went hunting Republicans. The only thing abnormal about him, as a Democrat, was that most Democrats only talk about wanting to shoot Republicans; this guy seems to have been a slightly more intensely Democratic Democrat, in that he actually did it.

    Laughner, by contrast, was a nut-job who showed no signs of any consistent political affiliation. Initially only slightly loopy, Laughner’s unstable behavior intensified after years of drug abuse, but correlation isn’t necessarily causation. The Southern Poverty Law Center, a leftist hate group, described Laughner as right-wing after the attack, but on the strength of two very ambiguous data points: 1. Laughner was, for a little while, a “gold bug”; i.e. opposed to fiat currency; and 2. he believed that government controlled people’s thoughts through control of language and grammar. At one point he made graffiti of a C and an X which was vaguely connected to Christian symbols, but by the time of the attack was anti-religion and consistently atheist. He voted sometimes, but always registered Independent.

    And that’s pretty much it. A devotee of Edmund Burke, this guy was not.

    There’s just no symmetry here.

    • Richard Aubrey

      We know this. But lefties, who also know it, continue pushing the lie on the presumption that there are some people dumb enough to believe. Persistence. Works.

  9. ” It is time for each of us to look ..” There is something bothersome about this and similar phrases. It sounds as if the author just had this revelation and the listener has yet to have it. What if the listener has long ago looked? What is one to think of those who, presumably have a likeness in political leanings, are just now coming to this conclusion? Why hasn’t this been as obvious as sunrise for XX number of years to anyone of us who follow political news. Welcome to the war. For 50 years or more the “opposition” has subverted our institutions, traditions, morals, and even language (redefining segregation as diversity for instance) taken complete control over media and educational systems and now the actual physical skirmishes are beginning. At the present moment the propaganda media is in full throat, supporting the violence, with some even calling for violence. Factions of the government, with full media support, are attempting to overthrow an election. This didn’t happen out of thin air, so one has to wonder why it’s only now time for each of us to look. Quit looking formulate a response.

  10. MC227

    One of the problems with these whacked out people talking like that is that the left has been drilling it into young minds for years that the most important thing in the world is feeeeeellings. Wrong. Feeeeeelings never built a house, harnessed electricity, landed a man on the moon, invented lifesaving medicine, developed air travel or much else. When you think feeeeeelings are more important than critical thinking and solving problems then we wind up with safe spaces, microaggressions, snowflakes- basically a huge group of people that are not connected to reality, participation trophies, entitlement mentality and claiming everything from owning a house to having a job, to belonging to a particular group as being a right. The fact is when you take rights from one person or group you are taking rights from another person or group. Save the feeeeeelings for your family and friends.

  11. Richard Aubrey

    Fine with me as long as I get to define “hate” speech. Which is why we don’t get to punish speech somebody dislikes, finds politically inconvenient, etc.

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